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re: winter heating: natural gas or electricity ?
3 dec 2001
wrote:
>>1. leaving the lights on for a few minutes when leaving a room and
>> returning saves energy.
>>
>>2. setback thermostats don't save heating energy.
>>
>>3. setback thermostats don't save cooling energy.
>>
>>4. turning a water heater off for a few hours a day saves lots of energy.
>>
>>5. keeping a fridge full saves lots of energy.
>>
>>6. keeping a freezer full saves lots of energy.
>>
>>7. bermed houses are just cold and damp and leaky.
>>
>>8. compact "flourescents" are a rip-off.
>>
>>9. many modern houses cannot be cooled just by opening the windows.
>>
>>10. thermostats will not remain on constantly.
>your list is a list of generalizations, and therefore inaccurate and
>deceptive.
i respectfully disagree.
>every statement in the list could be prefaced with a "some" or
>"sometimes" or some variation of some to make it more accurate.
some of these myths (eg #1) are absolutely wrong, but most of them
were originally stated in an all-encompassing sense, eg #8. the op
meant "all compact fluroescents are a rip-off." this is the myth,
as stated. the contrary (and reality) is "some compact fluorescents
are a rip-off." i did include a few qualifications, as in #5, "lots
of energy," vs just "energy." some of the myths are oversimplified,
eg #2, which may not be true for heat pumps. i've erred on the
side of brevity.
>i owned an older resistance heater where the airflow and design was
>such that during normal use the thermostat would cycle on and off even
>at high settings...
a lot of thermostats work that way, but the majority don't, imo.
they are not that clever :-) we could take a survey...
>place most heaters in the center of a cold auditorium and your
>statement that they will not cycle off is correct. generalizing that
>experience to the myth that all devices performing the same task
>operate in exactly the same manner is incorrect.
that was the myth, imo, that all heaters cycle.
>krh wrote:
>>typically, they'll cycle around 70% on/30% off in really cold
>environments, but once the air around it rises, the duty cycle
>changes to something closer to 50%.
>...notice that krh used the qualifier "typically" which refers
>to personal experience.
sure.
>so, beginning the "nick pine energy myth list" ...
that's the mcfl energy myth list. i am its humble channeler.
>1. stratification in water does not occur, but if it were to occur it
>would have no effect on heat loss through insulation. this fact can
>be easily verified by examining nicks calculations on heat loss and
>gain by masses of water.
wait a minute... #1 was:
>>1. leaving the lights on for a few minutes when leaving a room and
>> returning saves energy.
what does that have to do with water? which does stratify, btw, with
hotter water on top and colder water on the bottom.
>2. everyone who uses kw instead of kwh has nothing to contribute to
>any discussion concerning energy.
i disagree, altho that's a telling factor. my #2 was:
>>2. setback thermostats don't save heating energy.
this must be the official chickpea mcfl energy myth list,
vs the rewritten verbosely-qualified nick list.
>3. all appliances within a particular group operate in exactly the
>same manner.
again, the myth is that they all do...
>4. no bermed house is ever cold or leaky, nor has one ever been cold
>or leaky.
and that all are cold and leaky. of course some are...
>5. compact fluorescents from loa that cost over $7 and fail within six
>months are not a rip-off.
somebody seems to be confusing myths and realities here.
after 7 courses in symbolic logic, i'm not sure it's me.
>please rephrase your myth list to reflect reality, even if it requires
>longer explanations, qualifiers, and modifiers.
no thanks, but feel free to do so yourself.
nick (taking his new "refusitol vitamins.")
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